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And I have been happy to meet them and happy to welcome them. Chairman Leahy. Likewise, as my last inquiry, in a few of the testament today there has actually been a suggestion that, obviously, just with all the hundreds of billions, trillions of bucks ready to invest, you ought to simply go someplace else.

Stenger. I would tell you that in this environment the ability to elevate resources for things we are doing would have-- it is impossible to do so in a manner that would allow us as efficiently and as rapidly create the things we have done. You can borrow cash if you have actually got half down.

I can have obtained fifty percent of that if I had the $12 million in money to install. Every person understands that, yes, banks have money to loan as long as you have actually obtained fifty percent of it in your pocket prior to you ask for the various other half. That is not just how business functions nowadays.

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You are speaking from a real-world experience, not from a think storage tank experience. I will leave that just as an unjustified comment from the Chairman. Senator Grassley. Senator Grassley. Thank you. I want to be responsible in this problem of undocumented workers. I want to confess that we just have anecdotal information, however I would certainly such as to ask you to what level you need to go or do go to ensure that the centers ensure that the financial investments do not create tasks for individuals right here unlawfully.

Mr. Stenger. Legislator, I am a hands-on owner of a company, and I am on-property each and every single day. We have worked with-- as I said, at the Optimal we had 550 building employees on our project. The marching orders that I provided to my team is that we are to work with local firms in practically every circumstances to do all of the building and construction.

They are comprised of 10, 15, 20, 30 staff members. They are from our neighborhood areas. They are Vermonters. They are profiting straight from the investment. We are a hands-on facility. I recognize the employees, I recognize their family members, and we have had the ability to use-- via these last 3 years of terrible financial turmoil, we have actually had the ability to use practically every building and construction employee in our area and the bordering counties.

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locals. They reside in the area. Their family members are there. They are purchased the areas, and they are all U.S. employees. Senator Grassley. You do not need to use e-verify, yet I would love to know whether you do. Mr. Stenger. We do. Legislator Grassley. You do.

Thank you. Mr. North, along the same lines of the concern I asked him, has your research shown examples various other-- and I just offered one example, so I desire to admit that and be responsible regarding it-- of centers employing undocumented people? Mr. North. That kind of data is really tough to obtain from USCIS, and I should say that what we do understand about most of the internal things about that agency as for this program is worried associates with cases in which the staff has said no to an application of some kind and afterwards the local center or the specific business owner has mosted likely to the Administrative Appeals Office-- which becomes part of the company-- and there we obtain records, we obtain a hearing police officer telling us what is going on because certain case.



This is a negative application." There is a quantity of poor applications out there, yet only when that procedure gets prior to an administrative law court do we see much in the method of information. Currently, there was one instance that you pointed out, and allow me just specify on that particular a bit.

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Do not take too long due to the fact that I wish to ask an additional couple inquiries. Go ahead and quickly finish. Mr. North. The dairy products farm had actually claimed 17 workers, and they entered it, and the judge found that 16 of them were illegals. Now, that is the one instance I have, and it is an example.

Okay. I am going to ask different questions of each of the three of you, however it handles this set issue. As I stated in my opening statement, I am worried concerning the potential loophole that enables financiers to withdraw their investment in local centers after receiving their copyright.

Mr. Divine. I would claim that most of the investors, if you asked them what are their objectives, they would certainly claim, "I desire to obtain an environment-friendly card, and I want to maintain it.

Mr. Divine. Allow me ask Mr. Stenger, is it usual for an investor in your experience to withdraw his or her financial investment promptly after receiving an environment-friendly card? Mr.

Senator, no.

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